Foreign (H1b Visa) RPhs taking American Jobs Away from you?
Those of you who have followed my thoughts here and at Drug Topics, JP at Large, know that I have commented frequently on the highly educated professional Hib Visa holders.
They often have accents that my 1960s rock ‘n roll tone compromised ears do not get. Then (some of them, certainly not even a majority) will talk so fast that I get nothing useful. I have to ask them to slow down. I even have to ask them to spell the names and drugs. I say, “Please”.
Of course, this is when getting transfers. When they call to get a transfer from me, they miraculously speak slowly and distinctly.
Take a look at these figures.
Every one of you have scratched your head in dismay when you get a foreign pharmacist on the line at CVS.
Between 2001 and 2008
CVS applied to sponsor 3,590 H1b pharmacists. 15 were denied.
Rite-Aid 3,448 33 denied
Walgreens 1,477 13 denied
Kroger 295 7 denied
Safeway 359 6 denied
You can visit www.myvisajobs.com and spend a whole evening entertaining yourself. If you are a foreign pharmacist, you can see what is out there. This site has the wages that each company pays an H1b Visa pharmacist. Check out www.h1bvisa.com and www.h1bvisa.org It is absolutely amazing. It is a remarkable subculture.
Look hard and you will find a discussion board where H1b applicants discuss their chances. A girl from the Philippines tells of her excitement about landing a California job with CVS.
Doing this research, I see that the United States of America is screwing the goose educating our kids. There are millions of highly skilled foreigners holding H1b Visas. Dell computers sponsored 2,481 in the 2001-2008 period. Probably all engineers. We must do better. It could be your nephew who can’t do better than the night shift at Circle K because he was more interested in beer, babes and on-line games than doing what it takes to get marketable skills in the global economy. Globalization is systemic. It does not go in a straight line. You have noticed that it is all over the place. Dr. Reddy’s is in Mumbai. The genie is out of the bottle.
One question for any H1b Pharmacist to answer. When CVS sponsors are you essentially an indentured servant? You are not free to quit and go to Wal-Mart if you want. If Rite-Aid puts you in Dry Hut, Desert State where the provincial people don’t like the way you talk and mumble the word “terrorist” while you are picking out spices for the curry you plan for your two new friends (both Technicians) on Saturday night, can you quit if they do not honor your demand to be transferred?
Perhaps, H1b arrangements are in violation of USA labor laws if CVS actually gives preferential hiring treatment to H1b RPhs.
In the end, I believe that we need the H1b pharmacists to fill in the holes. However, if the shortage is over, as some of you have suggested, they go first. Is that unfair of me?
PS: I do not believe that the shortage is over. Far from it, but that is for another time.
Jay Pee
look at RxJoe’s comments. Do any of you actually believe that a new Rx can get scanned at your local CVS and then the typing of the Rx is out-sourced to a cheap Pharmacy Technician in Bangalore? If Joe’s $8000.00 per applicant is accurate, these five employers spent
almost $74 million.
8 Comments »
RSS feed for comments on this post. TrackBack URL
Well Jim, here’s a little tidbit for you. I was an H1b pharmacist that CVS sponsored (WELL before 2001). Of course, I had already been living here for over a decade by then and hardly had an accent. I still had to leave the country to get the visa (you have to go to the U.S. embassy in or nearest to your home country in person to get the visa stamped/printed/stickered/whatever into the passport. Let me tell you that it was the most stressful thing EVER because you are not guaranteed that you will be granted the visa once you arrive there, even if it was already approved!! In other words, you may not be able to go back to the US!!
I will also tell you that I was never treated any differently than anyone else while working for CVS, but that’s probably because I had a great work ethic and did just about anything asked of me anyways. Of course those were also the good old days when CVS wasn’t such a bad employer, a “busy” store filled 250-300 scripts a day, the whole industry/profession was in better shape, and pharmacists were still ranking first as the most repsected profession, ahead of clergy (remember that??). Let me tell you though, if this was today, and I was in a country with no jobs, with an offer from a US company paying 6 figures, I would go ANYWHERE and do ANYTHING they asked for!! Also, keep in mind that after 3 years you can apply for permanent residency and begin the naturalization process. When you finally get your “Green Card” you are free to quit and tell them to kiss your ass, which is always fun!!
Joe, it is always good to hear from you. It helps to marry an American. My daughter-in-law met my step-son in Afghanistan. She arrived in Galveston in May, 2008. They hired an immigration attorney immediately. She got her Green Card 6 weeks ago and her Social Security number 2 weeks ago. INS told her that she will take the oath in August, 2011. So, before three years the H1b RPh is an “indentured servant”?Is that correct?
While I’m all for those from around the globe coming here to better themselves, many times it comes at the expense of the American worker. We do not have many foreign-born pharmacists in my immediate area, however, we also do not have a demand for pharmacists either. I have spoken before about my district being OVER-STAFFED. I don’t think it is wise to let salaries be driven down by those who will do “anything” for the opportunity to work in this country and we all know that is exactly what the corporations want to occur. It is just another form of out-sourcing that will lead to even worse working conditions than we have now.
Hey there Slave. It’s not like outsourcing because they pay the same salary. It is (was?) a necessity due to the shortage. I have a feeling that the number have or will go down very soon. The reason being that 2 big player, namely CVS & Walgreens have starting real outsourcing, though for now (due to legal restrictions) can only do it locally. I’m talking about the programs where patients bring in scripts which are scanned by a tech at Drop-Off, only to be typed and verified off-site (again, for now this is done here, until they can make it legal for those people to be overseas getting paid 1/4 the salary as those doing it here). THAT is what people should be paying attention to, NOT the H1b guys.. that program will end as soon as a cheaper solution is found (I’m not even going to discuss the legal expences for these visas.. think $8k and up, and this was 15 years ago!!).
It sounds like H1b pharmacists are
treated better by their employers
than H1b IT workers, relatively
speaking. Much of the latter group
is held in what amounts to near
slavery. Of course, most of the
legions of un-/under-employed
scientists, engineers, et al now
dissuade their children from STEMM
careers, as those jobs get shipped
overseas, lost during M&As, etc.
There is no question in my mind that the potential for abuse exists in the use of H1b employees. These employees are not free to leave their employers so, therefore, they will accept working conditions (hours and locations etc) that might not be tolerated by those with a choice. This is certainly true where CVS is concerned. I interviewed with them and when I was told about the hours they expected me to work, I said “no thanks”. Also, while it may not be true in Pharmacy, I know for a fact that in the software development and IT industries, the H1b’s are paid less, work untenable hours, and can be isolated while working here in the US. They lived in company provided housing, travel to work in company provided cars or buses, and experience little of what this country has to offer. Many are virtually indentured servants.
I live in a major state university college town which has the largest foreign student body in US (according to the promo). The presence of a well-respected pharmacy school makes part-time job searches as difficult and competitive as any other pharmacy school town both for residents and non-residents. I live in this town because a large foreign student population affords raw competitiveness for education as well as allows my family to ‘fit into’ the diversity.
Although there are other factors, practically, a hospital is going to want to train a non-resident pharmacist that commits to at least 2-3 yrs at the job. (One way to think about it at one of my old hospital pharmacy jobs was based on high student caliber, managers got their pick of smart, new, cutting-edge eager short-term recruits willing to lick boots and not put up any flak. Managers could ram anything through because they didn’t have to behave cordially. The H1b worker wasn’t going to want to establish roots or expect a good relationship.
There is a solid cadre of techs in town who work day-in, day-out, so they’re not all that eager to hire and train techs unless they’re willing to go above and beyond every single minute of each day. Retail shops face similar issues of turnover and training.
In-town pharmacies are well-staffed, but there’s generally a worker shortage just 35 miles away from town any direction, plus we live in WASP-nest USA, and foreign students will not be welcomed, or at least have to overcome considerable workplace and local area hostility barriers to want to work at pharmacies around here.
H1b visas are set up for specific reasons, under specific guidelines including numbers, quotas, and percentages of sponsored employees, requirements to meet prevailing wage and labor conditions, tax criteria, and employers are not required to look locally before recruiting overseas. Non-resident spouses cannot work depending on the kind of visa, etc. H1b portability allows for transfer of a sponsoring employer relationship, but there isn’t any ‘grace’ period between transfers of sponsorship. Unlike some other visas the non-immigrant type of program supports eventual US immigration.
I guess the idea of wanting to work someplace at the same location to retirement age is not in vogue, anymore, anyway. I think most employers expect pharmacists to want to move about every so often.
Some nations allow duality of citizenship, and others require renunciation of nation of birth with application for US citizenship. Still others allow something in the middles such as Austria allows application to retain Austrian nationality while applying for US citizenship. Great Britain including Canada, to allow for duality. US agreements with Denmark, Singapore, Japan and others do not allow for dual citizenship. “US does not allow citizenship to interfere with criteria for payment of taxes”.
I guess I might have high emotions if I knew a job was ‘mine’ and someone came along and ‘took it’, but I don’t think we can depend on the ‘benevolence’ of employers.
Мде …
Как раз то, что нужно. Интересная тема, буду участвовать. Я знаю, что вместе мы сможем прийти к правильному ответу….
I live in Florida and find these foreign Pharmacist statistics useful.
I am considered an older pharmacist by definition and CVS terminated my employment.
A little while back another older by definition pharmacist was terminated.
I think that the availabliliiy of the many foreign pharmacists contributes to frivelous terminations.
I hear that foreign pharmacists accept lower pay–maybe 45 dollars.
I never thought about it much till it may be happening in my backyard
Is anybody else in Florida an older pharmacist by definition and terminated by a pharmacy? Those statistics may point to this occurring….
What do you think?